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T3 Industrial Cruiser

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Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 147	Posted - 2012.06.18 06:38:00 - [1] - Quote For starters, this is a really cool post. I've been waiting to see something like this, and it's really neat that you went to the effort to put this all together. However, I have a few issues I'd like to address. I'd like to see the other roles of industrials fleshed out more in this ship. It's primarily a mining ship, with almost no focus at all on hauling cargo. It does have an option to use mining foreman links, but there is nothing offering bonuses to salvaging, hacking, or archaeology. Here's an example of possible options: Industrial Subsystems: Freight Storage Optimization - 15% increased cargo capacity per level Covert Ops Reconfiguration - 30% bonus to mining laser yield and +3500m3 ore hold per level; 99.5% reduction in Cloaking Device CPU use; 90 second cloaking activation delay after deactivation of mining laser(s) Deep Space Extraction - 7.5% reduction in cycle time of gas miners and deep core mining lasers and +2000m3 ore hold per level Salvage Operations Reconfiguration - 25% bonus to range and towing speed of tractor beams and 5% bonus to salvager access difficulty per level Defensive Subsystems: Adaptive Shielding - 5% bonus to all shield resistances per level Amplification Node - 10% bonus to shield booster effectiveness per level Industrial Processor - 5% bonus to effectiveness of mining foreman gang links per level; 99% reduction in CPU need for Gang Link modules Drone Defense Computer - 10% increase in drone hit points and +15m3 drone bay per level; 10% increase in drone damage when drones attack automatically per level (there is no damage bonus when you tell the drones what to attack) drone bay size increase does not correspond to increased bandwidth Engineering Subsystems:* Fitting Service Adaptation - 5% reduction in capacitor recharge time per level; can fit fitting service module (high slot) - fitting service module: 10 minute cycle time, ship becomes immobile, consumes liquid ozone, ship has fitting service while module is cycling Power Core Multiplier - 5% bonus to power output per level Industrial Field Optimization - 10% reduction in capacitor cost and increased range of mining lasers and gas miners per level Reserve Power Storage - 5% reduction in capacitor cost of shield boosters and +500m3 capacitor booster charge storage bay per level; -75% powergrid cost to fit capacitor boosters (I imagine this would have much lower powergrid than a normal cruiser--this powergrid cost reduction is aimed at making it reasonable to fit a medium capacitor booster) Electronic Subsystems: Scanning Systems Optimization - 5% reduction in cycle time for all scanners per level (includes codebreakers, analyzers, ship scanners, cargo scanners, survey scanners, and the on-board scanner--but not probe scanners or salvagers) Obfuscation Manifold - 15% bonus to ECM target jammer strength per level Emergent Locus Analyzer - 10% increase to scan strength of probes per level CPU Efficiency Gate - 5% increase in ship CPU output per level Propulsion Subsystems: Interdiction Nullifier - Immunity to non-targeted interdiction; 850m3 cargohold Warp Core Magnifier - 10% reduction in penalties for fitting warp core stabilizers per level; +1 warp strength; 2750m3 cargohold Intercalated Nanofibers GÇô 7.5% increased agility per level; 1875m3 cargohold Thrust Optimization GÇô 20% bonus to max velocity per level; 50% reduced agility; 50% resistance to stasis webification effect; 3200m3 cargohold I've made the choice of propulsion system determine the amount of base cargohold you get, with dramatic differences from one choice to the next. Technically you can fit for a large ore bay as well as a large cargohold, but it's probably only good for mining in highsec. And even then you can't mine quite as fast as a retriever--I reduced the mining output of the mining bonus subsystem. I don't think this should be a fast miner at all, at the fastest it should be close to a retriever but less. (I'm talking about the new upcoming retriever) It's real purpose is not as a mining barge but as a tactical miner. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 149	Posted - 2012.06.18 17:51:00 - [2] - Quote Liliana Rahl wrote: I hate how CCP has classified haulers as industrials. What's wrong with that? I think of industrial ships as all industry-oriented ships, you know pretty much everything non-combat? There could be a much broader spectrum of exploration-oriented ships, but first CCP would have to make a broad spectrum of exploration. CCP has classified ALL of the following ships as industrials, and rightfully so, as they are all industry ships: Industrials ORE Industrials ORE Frigates Mining Barges Exhumers Industrial Command Ships Capital Industrial Ships [*] -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 150	Posted - 2012.06.18 19:37:00 - [3] - Quote Liliana Rahl wrote: It should be "racial hauler" or something to that effect. Not racial industrial. I can agree with that. Calling haulers industrials makes it sound as though industry in EVE is not the fleshed-out world that it is. I think perhaps a long time ago, industry in EVE was much simpler, and maybe the only ships used in industry were industrials and ships that chose to fit mining lasers. And since the latter weren't designed for mining, perhaps they chose to call the haulers industrials because they WERE the industrial ships...back then. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 150	Posted - 2012.06.18 22:16:00 - [4] - Quote Liliana Rahl wrote: a short, short list Small minds might think that's versatile. I can already do that many things with a tech 1 ship. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 150	Posted - 2012.06.19 01:02:00 - [5] - Quote Liliana Rahl wrote: Reaver Glitterstim wrote: Liliana Rahl wrote: a short, short list Small minds might think that's versatile. I can already do that many things with a tech 1 ship. Please tell me the T1 ship that can do all of those things as well as this ship would be able to. I'm terribly sorry that this ship doesn't also act as a mass hauler/explorer/ship hangar/Doomsday equipped/fighterbomber spewing salvage boat. I underlined what you missed, and I refuse to continue this discussion because it is beneath me. If you want to stop driving people away from debating with you, perhaps you should focus more energy on listening to what the person is saying, and less on trying to force your own ideas across. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 156	Posted - 2012.06.20 21:54:00 - [6] - Quote 1 3 5 -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 156	Posted - 2012.06.21 00:38:00 - [7] - Quote I think that regardless of any lack of skill or planning in many of the pilots you may come across, it should always be assumed that the pilots you meet are skillful and have planned their moves carefully. Everyone should be given a fair chance if they plan carefully. And that means that every careful plan should have a weakness, to allow another careful planner a route of entry. Mining in the deep parts of space should be viable, however I have a feeling that when the megacyte, zydrine, and morphite supplies start to run low players will find a way to get that stuff. The important thing is that it isn't available to people who don't have to work to get it. Once that is accomplished, the ships that were made for collecting it need to be made viable without being overpowered. I don't know how much interdiction nullification is the best amount, but I do know that it isn't a decision to be taken lightly. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 159	Posted - 2012.06.25 00:51:00 - [8] - Quote Liliana Rahl wrote: I'm tempted to remove the mercoxit bay, ore bay and gas chamber bonuses from the industrial subsystems, and create a generic ore bay propulsion subsystem and a gas chamber subsystem. Thoughts? I'm in favor of generic ore bays entirely. There is no need to box it in; just because it has a bonus to mercoxit mining doesn't mean it shouldn't be allowed to mine other stuff instead. Someone might think the slot layout or other bonuses make it useful for mining arkonor, or something. I don't know if gas should be put in the generic ore bay, but I don't think it should have a gas bay. Perhaps the gas mining subsystem would lend a smaller ore bay, or maybe if you allow this t3 to have a fairly large cargohold, the gas can just go straight to cargo. Here's something a bit off topic, but it's been annoying me and I had to vent: just as the tech 3 shouldn't have overly specialized roles, tech 1 isn't supposed to be highly specialized either. The tier 3 tech 1 battlecruisers have a bonus that only allows them to fit battleship turrets matching their skill bonuses, ie. an oracle cannot fit large autocannons if it wanted to. I disagree very strongly and I think they should all have a powergrid requirement reduction for ALL large turrets. End rant. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 162	Posted - 2012.06.28 20:36:00 - [9] - Quote I mostly approve of the changes you have made - though you forgot to update the hull construction reconfiguration in the OP. Still, I think you should consider adding other industry options to this vessel. By giving it a specific role (mining), it is not a strategic cruiser anymore, it is a mining cruiser. It puts it somewhere between tech 1 and tech 3 in the amount of versatility it has. But if I can't convince you, we'll just have to agree to disagree. Industrial Expansion Bay - you don't have any "propulsion" bonuses on this mod. Perhaps instead of a low slot, it should have +2 warp strength. And I suspect the wording is supposed to be "+5000m3 storage hold for ore and gas per level;" Perhaps a 4th propulsion subsystem could reduce sig radius and/or increase warp velocity? Just brainstorming. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 162	Posted - 2012.06.28 22:06:00 - [10] - Quote Emperor Salazar wrote: Actually, I thought of something to make the ore hold subsystem more "propulsion" oriented. -10% agility per level Thus, the bigger the bay, the slower you'll align/navigate. It's a nice idea, but you can't just lower your skill to get a smaller bay and more agility. Howabout a small ore hold without the penalty and another subsystem with a large hold and a big flat penalty? Like -50% agility role penalty -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens

Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 162	Posted - 2012.06.28 22:12:00 - [11] - Quote Emperor Salazar wrote: Reaver Glitterstim wrote: It's a nice idea, but you can't just lower your skill to get a smaller bay and more agility. I don't see why not. I mean, if increasing the level of the skill causes your ore bay to get bigger and your agility to go down, say one day you have a specific plan and you want to have a smallish ore bay with better agility. You can't just click a button to make your T3 Harvester Cruiser Propulsion Subsystem skill go down a few levels, and then come back up later at another button click. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 162	Posted - 2012.06.28 22:34:00 - [12] - Quote Howabout the skill increases the bay size slightly but doesn't affect the agility? 2500m3 base ore hold with a small agility BONUS, and the skill increases the ore hold size by 250m3 per level -or- 7500m3 base ore hold with a large agility penalty, and the skill increases the ore old size by 750m3 per level -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 193	Posted - 2012.08.04 19:01:00 - [13] - Quote Shameless necro. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 213	Posted - 2012.10.19 20:26:00 - [14] - Quote Solving puzzles would be really nice. It's kind of anti-climactic when I discover an ancient ruin and after cycling my archaeology module on the marked cases, I gather mostly generic archaeology tokens and a few uncommon units. It's like an archaeology training site made by the military. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc 215	Posted - 2012.10.26 05:39:00 - [15] - Quote nat longshot wrote: no t3's are not ment to mine. not CURRENTLY meant to mine. Is it wrong to come up with ideas for new ships? I don't know about you, but I personally like ideas that bring something new to the table. If you suggested a second set of tier 3 battlecruisers that were like normal tech 1 ships only with a bigger price tag than tier 2 battlecruisers and had more powergrid and HP, I'd say you're nuts and your idea is boring. But a tech 3 mining ship is brilliant. I still say it's a bit one-sided for a tech 3, I think it should be capable of more industrial applications, but it's still brilliant regardless. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens
Reaver Glitterstim Dromedaworks inc Tribal Band 247	Posted - 2012.12.10 03:30:00 - [16] - Quote Azrael Dinn wrote: nat longshot wrote: no t3's are not ment to mine. Any why not? I used mining laser II's on a gallente t3. miners seemed to work out just fine. What I would like to see on a T3 ore ship is that with the subsystems you could change it into a hauler also. So it would be a multipurpose ship like all the T3 ships are. I'm seeing ninja salvaging on battlefields in a t3 ore ship... yes See? That's what I'm sayin' too!! T3 is MULTI-purpose! Not mining only! Industry is mining/ice/gas harvesting+hauling+exploration+salvage+archaeology/hacking+probing+mining links+fitting service. -á"The Mittani: Hated By Badposters i'm strangely comfortable with it" -Mittens

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